It's not only the 'lying' it's is the feeling of arrogance ,
which comes with the fact thet you feel you are expected to - have to - accept the lies,
even when an ordinary normal person would give up on a lie , for it is so obviously a lie.
There is evidence which the liar patient knows you have that should convince any liar that the lie and their lying
is so blatant and obvious that carrying on defending it is not an option.

How to explain this as 'illness' .... and still don't know what to do.
Rejection does not seem to be 'on' with an ill person.
How is it that they behave as though they can 'get away with it '

Answer for me is that I still can't explain it, and still get taken in that it won't happen again
- but it does , and does, and does.

Similarly ordering products that follow on from not being able to pay for the previous same products,
having cheques bounce, clearly not having the funding to come in, yet ...and then doing this "
To *TF*,Dispatch and send a hundred or more sheets of paper HTFR mail order forms to the customer/name MR ,,,,, ..... at the address ..... ,ENGLAND, .... of CUSTOMER ID:H921803.A hundred or more sheets/copies of htfr mail order forms. Yours Sincerely MR .... ..... " Why a hundred - is this is what is called 'the grandiosity in the illness'

Is 'getting away with it', without the normal consequences, reinforcing it. It doesn't seem to matter what you do. How is that they think they can continue in the relationship after lying, denying it, lying agian trying to defend it, yet still expecting the listening 'friend family ' to just accept it, that you, the listener, can be expected to behave just as though nothing has happened.

Taken from a schizophrenia forum held on ... website

" I have a friend with a identical twin. Both grew up separated lives at a young age. Both seem to suffer from this same problem.

Something changed with my friend in recent years and it's getting really bad. Adult 40 yrs with an extreme problem telling lies.

I started to get angry all the time because almost everything was a lie. My friends whole life is a lie. But then the lies change and now they have a totally different life. My friend lies about everything from job to food, I don't know everything.

So I thought it was depression? Maybe they wanted to seem like someone who is doing better.

Right now my friend says he is the boss of a big company.

I know where he works making slight more than minimum wage.
He comes home with stories about his day and all the nightmare of problems, who he had to fire and so on.
It's not all bad sometimes it about good things to. But it is all a lie.

I think he makes it up and is aware of it, maybe some type of role playing due to depression.

He gets angry at everthing. He knows he has no control over it. He has not other friends because he lies too much.

I found it amusing and let him go on about it thinking he was depressed and role playing.

BUT

He has another problem on top of this.

He has paranoid delusions about everyone around him plotting to hurt him.

He gets really freaked out about it.
He will start a fight with someone on a cel phone if they are talking on their phone and looked at him.
He thinks they are telling someone bad things about him to hurt him.
He thinks when ever something goes wrong it is because some (anyone) planned earlier to mess him over.

It's terrible.

He has a computer with a strong password.
He lost files on it and was absolutely sure an elderly woman living near bye hacked his computer
and deleted the files and directly on his personal computer from his house.

It is clear that he is paranoid with out a doubt. He constantly thinks about what he wants and what is in the way of getting it.

Not getting past an obstacle by over coming or dealing with it but just how to get rid of it.

For example. He spent his money on something and then the bill came in.
He thought about paying the bill until he wanted to take a vacation.
Now he didn't have enough money for the vacation. He thinks the bill is stopping him from going.
He spent the money and that's why he doesn't have any left. But he can't see that so he says why should this bill stop him from getting what he wants.
So he just forgets about this bill to take a vacation. The creditor put collections on him and destroyed his credit report.
My fiend has not an emotion in the world over what happened only about his vacation.

Now he is upset that the lenders destroyed his credit report.
He still doesn't see that it is his fault.
He calls them up to yell at them blaming them for giving him credit like it's their fault. He has enough money to pay the bill???

OK Now you know a bit about my friend.

I can't figure out why he makes up these fake stories.
Mostly all of his stories can't even exist.
So he works his day job but tells me he is somewhere else and this incredible thing is happening.
He will then talk about this incredible thing for hours and hours.

He saw a woman. "SAW" Never spoke to.
He keeps telling me about the relation ship and all the problems they have together.
She doesn't even know him.
He will call me up because he and this woman got in to a really big fight
and complain about how she treats him and says she does this and that and how angry it makes him.

I can't keep listening to him. He is a good friend but why does he lie like this.

He is incapable of telling the truth. It's not like he lies to gain anything.
His lies are not even believable. Most of them are about bad things.
Many of them are about conversations he "over hears" about people talking about him plotting to harm him.
I get angry and confront him. I say you heard this from WHO? He throws a name out.
It turned out that this person was not even in town that day.
So I threw that back at him and he said well no he didn't actually over hear it that someone told him they said it. I said WHO.
He got mad and hung up the phone with me.

Why does he do this. I think he knows he is lying. But sometimes he believe the lies after a while too.

But I know he makes stuff up that he admits he intentionally lies about. His personality is always the same.

No changes.

Is this schizophrenia and what can I do about it. Do I have the right to be mad at him for lying?

---

Someone I know has Paranoid Schizophrenia . I just wanted to know if LYING is part of his condition. I don't know if I should be angry at him.
He is aware of the lies.
The only time I suspect he is unaware of the lying is when he goes off on his paranoid delusions.
But that I can understand.

But what about lying for everything else.
His motivation I guess about lying is to make him self feel better when in depression
. But the lies are not exactly fully in touch with reality. But in any case I think he knows he is lying.

Part of his schizophrenia or is he a bad person who likes to deceive people?
His lies hurt people. He seems to enjoy it. I would like to understand before I pass judgment
on an old friend that I apparently really never knew because his life was all lies.

What I do know is that he has Paranoid Schizophrenia and Depression. Does he have control over his lying?

An illness has taken a curious form. He was 'obsession - persistent - before his illness - when acquiring things he wanted he would want the whole set and not give up till he ha it e.g saving birthday money and buying the complete set of Lego, rather than building from small kits.

In the last year since learning about Ebay, and catalogue e-mail ordering he has accumulated in his room [aged thiry-six,now } quantities of juvenilia - Noddy items, hand held elecronic games,cricket annuals, ordering them without enough regard for how he will pay for them Here is one such Order

" To Sir C******t, I am sending this message to you at PO BOX ******** D****** informing you to deliver and dispatch the board games:Risk Board Game by Parker,Qty 1,code RIS02,Dungeons and Dragons byTSR,Qty 1,code DUNM2,Lord of the Rings Board Game by Hasbro,Qty 1,code LOR32,Blockbusters Family Board Game,QTY 1,code BLO62,Game Of Lofe Board Game by MB Games,QTY 1,code GAMH2,Connect 4 by MB Games,QTY 1,code CON12 of the Basket total:£127.00p.This list of items for mailing on order should be dispatched to the billing,delivery addressxxxxxxxx England, xxxxx to the sender,my name :xxxxx xxxxxx of the Email Address xxxx xxxx : and a cheque made out to "Sir C*******t" should reach you in an envelope as the method of payment of the total £127.00p. Yours Sincerely xxxxxxx .

He will deny doing this and has stolen money from me to follow his 'compulsion' . It is likely that only since acquiring the skills to use the internet that this is happening now. If he always had he skill it might well have happened before. He has at times sent 'demanding' emails' but inoffensive ones, to his siblings, on similar lines " order and send to me .... various juvenilia --- up to twenty emasils in one day . I have my ways of intercepting them but it's a close 'contest between him and me !!!

In longterm illness like this patients in hospital would somettimes - when asked the date - give the date - and the age as that when they were first admitted.

It's as if life important experience is stuck at what happened before the illness - experience afterwards insufficently registered to replace previous importance - so that current living is only loosely being backed by the accessible and updated experience - that seems to be made available in a different and 'unsticky ' route'. The internal delusional life , being not opn to anybody else, means you are special ? or just that decisions taken under the illness influence are irretrievable to ordinary reflection - perhaps the starting point is not held in mind - so any outside interchange cannot be carried on ordinarily .

Anyhow - What to Do !!! The general advice is that the more sufferers are expected to behave be able to be better, or are not accepted for behaving worse, the more likely for staying at a better level. Going along with it leads to less of being better., socially, and more allowing misbelief and the other world to dominate

Any carers having similar experience

Please comment - with experience - and advice !!

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